choke hold / strangle hold

Wednesday, September 08, 2004

if you hate your friends, you're not alone

sexy paul was right... it works, and you can see for yourself. those of you that have decent computers can wave goodbye to long distance telephone costs: http://www.skype.com/

and the best part, as far as i am concerned - is that it is both mac-friendly and the sound quality is stellar. if you want to do some long distance (or short distance) calling - you can add me to your list - girlxsetsxfire - and that’s all i have to say on that.

***

i wish that i had something else to talk about besides this - but it is on my mind and it is bound to come out. let’s talk a little about dating/ mating.

i have some circles of friends that fuck everyone else in that group. yes, they do. it’s no big deal... it’s all fine and good and people don’t take it too seriously. jealousy and hurtfulness is less a part of the equation because no one is monogamous to anyone else. while the affection is there - the score is not about ‘falling in love’... dig me? these people tend to be pretty upfront about what they are doing and who they are doing it with and how they feel about what’s going on around them.

and then there are other groups of friends. they tend to date monogamously. they aim for long term and for love and they get it on with one human at a time. the funny thing is, that these groups of friends tend to be the groups that do things that are ‘unclassy’. they date each other’s exes without owning up to the hurt that it will cause. they breech the monogamy contracts that they have willingly engaged in and try and pass it off as someone else’s lack of integrity.

i won’t bother picking sides. monogamy, polyamory, bootie call.... do whatever you want. do what works for your life. but my question is always why people seem to be so utterly incapable of just being honest and holding to their integrity.

no matter what people’s sexual lifestyles are - the sexual/ intimate realm is a vulnerable one. and if you are pissing in a gene pool with people who lack honesty and respectfulness - it is bound to bite you (and those around you) in the ass.

in the words of henry rollins “you are who you fuck”.

10 Comments:

At 11:23 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Is this partially directed towards me?

--Marlo

 
At 1:49 PM, Blogger rabblerocket said...

If I don't belong fully to that second camp, it is only for ideological reasons. Your post reminds me of a saying about the difference between "nice guys" and "players" -- which is that the nice guy takes the extra effort to convince himself that his lies are true.

Y.

 
At 2:26 PM, Blogger psychicle said...

I'm not directing this comment at anyone in particular. I'm not addressing the context in which this post might have been made. I'm only interested in talking about the "next step" when you experience frustration like this in general. Disclaimers having been made, I move on.

We define integrity for ourselves; we set up our own parameters of what are acceptable and not acceptable behaviours. How can we answer when our friends hold an alternative framework of values?

I'm of the belief that we can't count on the validity or superiority of our own set of values, so when these come into conflict the only thing we can do is sit down, have some tea, and talk it through (sometimes yell it through). From here, irreconcilable disagreement can effect all sorts of outcomes both negative (never talking again) and positive (increased respect for an different way of seeing behaviour, possibly). But I do think the first step is to direct frustrations at the source.

Integrity is slippery. Some people find it easier - sometimes more important - to own up to actions taken that may hurt others. But mitigating forces - guilt, shame, self-righteousness, whatever - often make doing so more difficult. Not to mention confusion and self-doubt. Importing the guidelines we'd use to govern our own lives into someone else's usually causes more division or introduces more ways for the 'issue' to be misunderstood. Ultimately, I think, integrity to me means reconciling your own actions with your own values.

(end brain fart. ttthhhhhbbbbbpppppp.)

 
At 6:39 PM, Blogger choke_hold said...

i agree with janet that integrity is a slippery thing. and depsite some people's assumptions - this posting was not written merely about toren/marlo. it was written about several things that are going on in my own life - and in the lives of my friends right now.

i also agree that people have to figure out what integrity means to them.... but it is understandable that when your friends and lovers present themselves as having particular values and then they violate those values - that it will be disorienting and sometimes painful for the people around them.

the question my post remains: why do people seem so incapable of holding to their own integrity and being honest to those around them? and that is a question for everyone - myself included.

the writing of this post was not intended to shame anyone. it is a statment of my constant amazement of people's inability to think outside themselves. and a musing on how different sexual lifestyles have played out in *my* life. the things that i observe.

 
At 1:42 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

On the general topic, not on any specific situation:

I think that we (collectively, individually, in varying degrees) have such fear of pain that we resist acknowledging the pain/hurt we cause. General responsibility avoidance. If we're honest about the harm we cause, it reminds us of all the harm we've received. It's much easier to be indignant about those who have hurt us, and rationalize the hurt we dole out.

Not anonymous, but instead it's Michelle (waiting for the rain to stop so she can play outside)

 
At 3:42 AM, Blogger choke_hold said...

mason - you can be called sexy mason if you want to be. better yet, you can pick your own nickname. i thought that "high fivin' mason" would be too long though. hahahhahahha. you pick a new name and i will change your name on my blog. promptly. for reals.

 
At 4:39 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

more ideas on why...:
- because one human on his/her own is complicated; throw in one or a few more, along with integrity, morals, societal/cultural norms and expectations - and it's a fucking mess (sometimes literally)!
- people like to have an idea of who they are (a list of qualities, if you like) and being hurtful is usually not something one wants to admit to having on their list
- you want your cake and eat it too, but don't want to admit you're greedy
- because you can - people don't always call you on the fact that you've hurt them, so if it "worked" once (i.e. no consequences or pain that you had to face, and you got what you wanted), you'll do it again; or maybe you're not aware of the fact that it's hurtful or to what extent; or you're aware but choose to ignore it
- sometimes it's easier to cultivate your personna then face your person (similar to yvonne's quote)
- you believe what's been told to you about "right" and "wrong" and you hate being "wrong"; or figuring out why "wrong" might be also be "right" (not to mention trying to explain it to somebody else) can really hurt, and can seem scary

i could go on... and no, not claiming to be innocent of the above.
it's d.

 
At 8:21 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

even though your blog entry isn't directly about what commentator #1 "fears" (it took me awhile to find the right word ...im goin' with fear) i feel like everyones input is so freaking heady my brains gonna explode...

im the one in this assumed situation thats the hurt victim.
an i guess i just wanted to make an apperance in this little blog community....for dramatical purposes.i want to be careful that i dont turn this into some degrassi bullshit .so i guess i'll just post the positive bit of consolation from it all,and it is that i learned the difference between sympathy and empathy.thanks ang,although right now im confused cause im trying put it in words...words that im sure about spelling.
i think these "blogs"(except yours of course) should now be refered to as blahgs.
-james

 
At 11:34 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Did you ever see that episode of Beavis and Butthead where Henry Rollins was doing a spoken word thing in the coffee house they were in? It was cool. He ended his speech with the line "and then... you die." Beavis And Butthead is my favourite TV show if you were wondering.

ahh, well, anyway, hey, fucking around is pretty much crap, you should learn. A trusting relationship is the most rewarding thing in life. Actually, a smith grind on a rail or kickflip into a noseslide is pretty rewarding too now that I think of it. But in a different way I guess.

-david

 
At 5:06 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Toren is a coward. Read his blog. It's self-evident. It's no surprise he waited to tell James after James had heard of the Torlo relationship from other 3rd parties, then waxes on about how he feels bad about having waited. It doesn't take a genius to deconstruct the selfish and narcissistic sentiments that Toren hold near and dear to his heart. It's all in the blog and his website. A little Derrida deconstructionism goes a long way.

The relationship may have been a surprise to Marlo. But Toren has been after her for several years. He just struck lucky while she was most vulnerable.

It's not a relationship that is going to last anyhow. So all the selfishness will be for naught. Marlo can't see past her nose, and inside 6 months will be bored and begging for her freedom.

 

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